I saw Michael Moore's SiCKO last weekend, and I strongly recommend it to all. It's Moore at his best -- or worst, if you're on the receiving end -- because it makes its main points powerfully and convincingly. It's hilarious, infuriating, saddening and enlightening all at once. But more than anything else, it is a devastating indictment of how health care is provided in America and a wakeup call about the upside-down way most Americans have been encouraged to think about the problem. This movie turns the current discussion of "universal coverage" on its head. It's about time.
As today's New York Times article notes, most of the Democratic candidates are gravitating towards some plan for universal health insurance. You'd get insurance through your job, or on your own, or perhaps through a pool of insurance providers in which insurance premiums are subsidized. The candidates may disagree on details about how this is done, exceptions or incentives for small businesses, whether it's mandatory or not, or how long it takes to phase in. Lots of details.
The problem is that these details are complicated for voters, and what's worse, they're dealing with the wrong questions from the voters' perspectives. Why should voters have to sort through these complicated details about insurance coverage? They want health care when they need it, not insurance that may or may not cover them, depending on pre-existing conditions and arbitrary coverage decisions over which they have no control, decisions that can leave them financially devastated.
The Republican candidates are even worse; they're struggling to define their proposals without having to confront the problems of "universal coverage." But mostly they're adamant about keeping the government out of the health care system, even though the most successful and popular system in America -- Medicare -- is essentially government managed. Remember, these are the bozos who want to replace Social Security with -- remember -- private insurance. The American people loved that one.
Moore's SiCKO very cleverly starts from this peculiarly Republican obsession against government-provided health care. It then examines how the private insurance system actually works in America -- and it's one infuriating and heartbreaking horror story after another; real stories, real people, consistently denied care by a system of perverse incentives that rewards insurance companies for denying claims. We listen as administrators and even doctors working for the insurance companies -- not for patients -- explain how the entire system has become morally corrupted by a system in which insurance companies tell practicing doctors what treatments make sense, based on what makes the insurance company healthy. Bring your anti-angry pills for this part. But then Moore hooks up with friends/relatives in Canada, and all of sudden, the conversation completely changes.
You see, the Canadians didn't start by asking how we can get everyone insured, or how we could force employers to provide insurance. Instead, they started by asking, "How can we assure quality health care for everyone?" When you start with the right question, you get a very different answer. Moore then drives this distinction home with amusing scenes of him wandering around trying to figure out how his patient friends -- who quickly get treated without question by the Canadian system -- will be charged, how they will pay, what insurance forms they have to fill out, how they qualify, how they defend against insurance claim denials, and so on. The answer is: They don't; none of that nonsense exists.
When you start with the right question, "how can we provide health care for everyone without hassle," the system you get provides you health care for everyone without hassle. The patient needs care; the patient gets care. Questions about how it's paid for are not something the patient ever deals with, other than participating/voting in the political process to determine how taxes are raised and allocated for all government services. Because that's what health care is: an essential public service to which every person (not just citizens) is entitled, just like police and fire protection, and health and safety inspectors, and schools and dozens of other essential public services.
The rest of the movie has Moore checking out the systems in the UK, France, and eventually Cuba (including Guantanamo!). Everywhere he goes, their governments asked the right question first, and they got universal, no hassle health care -- all the time, for everyone, no questions asked -- plus free house calls if needed, and extended maternity leave and support, and . . . If you've traveled abroad and needed care, you know.
Along with this powerful message, Moore provides the humor by continually asking questions in each country that only make sense in America's perverse and inhumane system, questions that are just nonsensical everywhere else. Everyone looks at him in bewilderment, because America's health care debate is not about health care. It's about nonsense. No one else is confused by the wrong questions.
It's time we insisted our Democratic candidates stopped talking nonsense and started answering the right questions. All the candidates should throw out their current proposals and sit down together and come up with a Democratic plan, based on universal care. Start with the right question: Don't tell us how we're going to get insurance. Tell us how we're going to get care, with no hassle, no forms, no worries, no denials, no discrimination. Health care for everyone, when they need it, where they need it. That's what Democrats should offer to the American people. We can figure out how to pay for it, and how to make the transition, just as our friends and neighbors did, in committee hearings later. But first things first.
America is ready for universal health care, and if they're shown a good model, they'll pay for it. If the Democrats answer those questions intelligently, and just look at what our neighbors and allies do, we can have a Democratic plan that will bury the Republican party in 2008. And if our Party needs help fending off the anti-government crazies and their allies in the other party who will do everything they can to keep something that enriches them but doesn't work, costs too much, and benefits only a few, don't worry. We'd like that fight.
Go see SiCKO, and then ask your Party leaders to start answering the right questions.
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zed?
‘Morning, Scarecrow.
Michael Moore emailed a letter to folks this morning about an internal memo by a Blue Cross provider. I’ll see if I can find my copy.
They are very nervous in the industry.
edit: Found it. The PDF of the internal memo, complete with talking points here.
I’ll have to post Michael’s comments if I can’t find them on a site.
Hi Scarecrow
If the Democratic Congress could get single payer health care, we’d win hands down.
Thank you!!!!
Yes, the question is how to provide health care, not how to provide insurance.
Insurance does not deliver care. Insurance delivers “benefits” (depending) and dividends (for sure!).
Health care is delivered by providers. And as a provider, I can assure you that insurance is a nightmare - just as it is for patients!
Our difficulty in this country, among other things, is that the populace has been brainwashed. People believe (wrongly) that this is the “best country in the world.” They believe (wrongly) that health care “choices” involve “insurance choices” - rather than diagnostic or treatment choices.
Until people take off the blinders - placed there by those who want to pull the wool over the eyes of the citizenry - I fear we will never have quality health care, let alone civil rights and peace and good government.
Thank God for blogs!
Good morning Scarecrow!
Most candidates are leaning towards a “Leave No Health Insurance Company Behind” model. Why give up all those riches in campaign contributions. The insurers are the problem where profits are more important than care.
Just think Medicare Prescription Drug Plan, and that’s were we are headed with those plans.
JF @ 1
Ahem. The appropriate first comment on my threads is “Caw, caw.” If you don’t like the post, you can use fewer letters. This is your final warning. ;)
TheraP @ 4
Thank you — I’d like to hear more from health and insurance providers — how the system works, or doesn’t.
Good morning, Scarecrow! Excellent post (as usual). Can’t wait to see SICKO-what a great title.
I’ve always thought Democracy is about asking questions, and constantly seeking something better. As you rightly point out, the correct questions need to be asked, as well.
Rayne, its on Michael Moores site
http://www.michaelmoore.com/wo.....php?id=215
Rayne @ 2
Just from reading Scarecrow’s crystal clear analysis, I’d say they should be quaking in their boots.
And Good Morning, everypup
All we have to do is ask the right question. It’s that simple.
I’m particularly amused and impressed by the “New Health Markets” Edwards talks about, essentially putting a Medicare-like non-profit insurer in competition with the existing for-profit insurers. Thom Hartmann was discussing it yesterday as the slow death of the monolithic insurance companies, which could only be a good thing for health care.
Scarecrow @ 7
Pardon moi! Excellent post, Scarecrow. This is an issue that we really need to have a national debate on.
My wife has rheumatoid arthritis, and was lucky enough to be referred to one of the nation’s top doctors when she was oroginally diagnosed 12 years ago. Now that doctor only accepts one insurance plan, and we have to scramble every year to make sure one of our employers carry that plan.
The balancing act between price and coverage is a nightmare.
I grew up under national health in France and then in Australia. I am terribly frustrated at all the misinformation disseminated by the Republican party about the evils of national health. I always chose my own doctors, never had to wait for an appointment, I never had a hassle getting admitted or treated in a hospital, preventive care is abundant, programs like weight loss, anti-smoking, and exercise are provided free or cheap, my sister had wonderful pre- and during and post- natal care when she had her baby, drugs are free or cheap, and the bureaucracy that patients deal with is non-existent, and that doctors deal with is minor. AND our doctors drove Mercedes or Beemers and lived in very nice houses.
That is NOT to say that each system does not have its problems, but since we have the opportunity to design a system from scratch, surely we are smart enough to learn from others’ mistakes and take the best of each program and mitigate the problems? Cobbling together “universal health care” using the existing private insurance programs is just about the worst idea available.
I live in Massachusetts, and as of July 1, Mitt Romney’s law requires that everyone obtain coverage or face penalties. Wow, what a great idea! Penalize people who remain without coverage because they don’t know about the law, don’t know how to find out what to do, cannot navigate the bureaucracy, and have to choose between coverage or food but don’t qualify for help — and call it universal health!
Can’t find Michael Moore’s comments about the Blue Cross internal memo at the Sicko site, so I will provide here in thread. These prefaced the actual memo linked above in my previous comment.
While I’m not sure I subscribe to the notion that profit is and by itself a bad thing, I think that profit as a motivator to provide health care is not working. Nor is non-profit care working where available, since providers which are non-profit are still at the whims of the rest of the industry. The system is a huge mess, with virtually every facet of health care delivery in need of a dramatic overhaul. I just hope that we can muster the political will to address it in 2008 as a nation.
I strongly defend the use of zed on any post. Even Scarecrow’s.
[Waiting to be smited]
snowbird42 @ 10
Thanks, snowbird, must have been looking too narrowly at the Sicko content alone.
It’s Tahlequah time here. Lahoma is fixing breakfast. I’m making the fried cornbread. And we both just wanted to say: We like Mr. Moore.
If you ever get the chance, please, let us invite you to come see us.
Tahlequah - Northeast (Green Country)
http://www.travelok.com/cities.....=Tahlequah
daryljfontaine @ 12
Is there a link to hartmann — if Edwards is getting at the right question through stealth, I’d like to understand that.
Medicare works. For my elderly parents (85 and 90) and for my husband. It doesn’t work for me yet - due to being “under age.” On the other hand what fun it was to try and help the elderly parents negotiate Part D (the drug nightmare! - due to being provided by insurance).
Medicare works for me as a provider. You bill. They pay. Maybe they don’t pay to the tune of a few insurances, but indeed they actually pay more than many!
Insurance can drive everyone nuts, especially when it comes to mental health, where it seems that they want to disrupt treatment, rather than facilitate it. One way to disrupt it is simply to change the managed care agencies the insurers use - year by year. Imagine being in therapy and you can no longer see your therapist….. That’s helpful!
I could write a book!
(but I will restrain myself)
rebmarks — thanks. Your story sounds like many in the movie.
There are three things which pre-occupy Americans. Medical care for their children. Education for their children. And bringing their children home from Iraq. We have kids in our family serving in Iraq. We want them out of harm’s way.
Do Canada and the other countries who have universal healthcare also include mental health care in their systems?
TheraP @ 20
maybe you should write a book!
Would that the frontrunners had but a fraction of the guts that Moore has. Shame on you two.
Thank you for writing this, Scarecrow. Not only are the concepts of insurance and care conflated and confused by the public, but healthcare reporters confuse the two, as well. Both the NYT and WaPo had incorrectly titled stories this wee about the mandate in MA that everyone have health insurance. Both titles called it universal health.
The insurers, I believe, are aiding and abetting this confusion. I wrote a post recently that essentially was a glossary of terms about health care. Single payer is a term that is wrongly attributed to be a socialized medicine model. It’s not - it simply refers to a single source of healthcare reimbursement.
It’s criminal that the all powerful health insurance industry profits at the literal expense of people’s lives. It causes preventable deaths. It causes financial ruin. It destroys lives and it destroys the lives of patients’ families.
How is it that we are mandated to purchase something that has no value, whatsoever, causes suffering and death, and serves only the investors?
Our country is so far off the moral high ground and is sinking in the quicksand of lies, false and misleading rhetoric and unfettered capitalistic greed.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 22
And for the many of us who don’t, and will not, have children?
Oklahomans for Gore!
The proposal that is simple and effective and will bring reductions in cost.
The government out of medical care taxes pays providers a yearly payment for providing services to all patients showing up at the door.
Each year the government renegotiates the amount of this payment individually with providers and considers the number of patients, the quality of care, and patient satisfaction in negotiating.
Funds are disbursed monthly without reference to fee-for-service justifications.
The government sets aside a certain proportion of funds each year to handle catastrophic public health situations.
That’s it. Simple.
raven @ 27
;0)
Rayne — great letter; I think the industry assessment is correct. If people see this film, it could radically change the debate in America. Thanks for bringing the letter here.
raven @ 27
Do you not have friends and family who have kids?
I strongly advocate socialized medicine. Can I go to jail for saying that?
anangryoldbroad @ 23
Dunno — any Canadians, etc , here this a.m.?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 33
Actually, if you go to jail you get socialized medicine. Just like Guantanamo detainees.
Scarecrow @ 19
This is what I found… the podcast of yesterday’s show is available online at the White Rose Society, and this page provides the username and password you need to connect.
The discussion of healthcare to which I was listening came in the 90-minute to 2-hour mark in the commercial radio broadcast.
For some reason,America seems to have forgot that we can multi task. There are close to 300 million of us,one would think that number of people(esp the 230 mil or so over age 18)could come up with all kinds of solutions to problems.
Since America is the only industrialized nation without universal healthcare,AND other countries have been doing it for awhile,we could,oh,maybe learn from their mistakes and design something that would be the envy of the world. We have a hopsital/healthcare infrastructure already in place,it just needs proper funding and less complexity.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again…the Dems are never going to present themselves as believable advocates for causes like this until they get over their fear of talking about it and start being more direct. It’s not like the party agenda is a big secret and being wishy washy or running away from it is just going to look weak.
egregious -
Sure, even sub-geeks get muffins *g*. They weren’t virtual but real; just invited my Dem buddy from down the street in to have one. Will have to share recipe if Christy ever does another Pull-up-a-chair food fest again.
Back to read what’s sure to be another good Scarecrow post; movie isn’t on here yet but am looking forward to seeing it.
daryljfontaine @ 36
Thanks for the link.
Elliot @ 24:
Chapter 3
My son was born in Canada - 38 years ago. We paid extra for a private room - $10 a night extra. (they made me stay there for a week) The doctor never billed for his 10% for the outpatient care. The care was wonderful.
Several years ago I sprained my ankle on vacation in the Canadian Rockies. No, not hiking. In a car wash - with an unexpected drop when you needed to open the door and get out briefly. The tiny ER in the next town provided excellent care - for a total of about $600 - because we were visitors to Canada. That’s way cheaper than your US ER. Go and find out!!!
(I think I have said enough for one thread - the moral of the story: move to Canada. Wish I could. The elderly parents are here - too late to move them.)
Socialized medicine is that which is controlled by the government. I don’t think I want to turn over professional practice control to non healthcare providers.
But single payer can be done by adding all Americans to it. Medicare currently spends about 1.5 to 3% in administration costs. Healthcare administration costs, overall run between 30-40%! That includes the layers upon layers upon layers of people who do nothing but handle claims: submitting them, processing them, denying them, appealing them, paying them, etc.
The argument that severely constricting this industry would put thousands out of work doesn’t speak to the need for tens of thousands more physicians and nurses and other patient care providers. It doesn’t speak to every other industry that became obsolete and put workers out of careers. It sure doesn’t speak to the millions who have had their jobs outsourced to other countries while the companies reaped the financial windfalls.
Scarecrow @ 8
I’m not sure you or the other readers have the stomach for it. I have worked at one of if not the main culprit (one of Sicko’s target Insurane companies.. Trust me M. Moore left the gloves on making this movie. It is actually worse than he describes..
SilenceIris @ 38
And a big part of the problem is who funds their campaigns. Pachacutec’s post a couple days back on Hillary et al and who is financing them is a big factor here.
Health care is just one more tool the establishment uses to control working Americans. We’re reduced to begging for a job we don’t particularly want, or begging to keep a job we don’t particularly want, because we need the benefits.
Imagine how liberated we would be if we decoupled health care from a job. We could choose the job we want and leave the job we don’t want.
mc @ 32
Yes, and I spent more than 20 years working in municipal recreation programs trying to change the way parents and other adults treat their kids in sports programs. I questioned OK’s premise that “There are three things which pre-occupy Americans. Medical care for their children. Education for their children. And bringing their children home from Iraq.” I loves the Kiddo but I don’t have to agree with every word he says.
N=1:
Medicare beneficiaries do not receive care controlled by the government. They receive care controlled by themselves and providers.
Insurance beneficiaries often receive care controlled (or rather “patrolled”) by insurance companies - which interfere at every level with the so-called “freedom” the beneficiaries have.
(sorry I broke my vow not to post again - I will blame it on rage)
I just cannot see how anyone who receives the second largest contributions from the health care industry can campaign on that issue with a straight face.
Thanks Scarecrow –
And I have one more issue that I wish had been mentioned in the film, because I don’t even know if most Americans know this could happen to them.
My husband has “full” health coverage for which we pay substantial premiums with a top-of-the-line insurance company. He had a catastrophic accident that cost the insurance company probably over $500K by now (no exaggeration) — not to mention the $thousands we have spent in co-pays. We sued the woman who plowed him down on the road. She had the minimal auto insurance required, and we ended up settling for $23K because she basically has no assets. This does not come close to compensating him, but may help provide for some technological equipment that is otherwise not covered to help him get around, and help pay a few bills.
The insurance company has now put a lien on the settlement, and our lawyer is trying to get them to drop it — my husband’s injuries were so major that he will be affected for the rest of his life, and if more auto insurance or other assets had been available, this would have a been a multi-million dollar case. And now it’s possible that he might not even get the few $$ that WE fought to get with no help from his medical insurance company. Even after paying through the nose for that coverage for years!
If BCBS of Massachusetts is reading this — we appreciate the mostly good experience we have had with you through this hard time, but please, someone at your company has got to realize that this is a cruel joke.
Scarecrow @ 8
They question I’d have for candidates: Why is the US the only one among like the top 20 industrialized countries with out single payer insurance. Don’t any of them realize it is hurting our competitiveness? Just ask the car companies.
I’m one of the people who has experienced health care in France. I got a cut above my eye walking into a door at a museum. A trip to the hospital in an ambulance, accompanied by a paramedic, immediate treatment in an emergency room, glued together, handed a sheet explaining concussion symptoms in English, and when I asked about paying they looked at me like maybe I had a concussion and told me it was free.
We’re going to live in France for extended periods when we retire.
TheraP @ 41
aooh I’ve been to the ER!
What a contrast between here and there.
Mojo — appreciate your perspective. I’m not one who assumes insurance is evil, since it’s a form of shared risk that has many useful applications. But the way it’s set up in health care seems to provide incentives to deny care, not provide it. And it’s understanding the incentive structure that interests me. I deal with market rule at work, and how how you write the rules determines the incentives that people follow. Anything you can add on how the rules affect the incentives would be appreciated.
Rebmarks @49
This is a real lesson, everyone should buy as much uninsured motorists coverage as they possibly can afford. It is relatively cheap and covers exactly this problem.
Excellent, — Thank you, Scarecrow. I wrote to our new Governor, and State Senate and House leaders (Democrats) and asked them what tey were doing about the Unlovely Romney’s Insurance Company Gravy Train he had delivered to us here in Massachusetts….. and naturally have had no answer.
When one reflects on how expensive per head what we DO have is, with lower yardsticks of success than other countries one can see just how we are screwed by the insurance companies.
raven@46:
I misunderestimated your intent. I agree with the notion that there are many other things that pre-occupy Americans. But for those of us with kids, it’s unthinkable that someone wouldn’t be enchanted with the little
brats, er, sweethearts.TheraP @ 47
Medicare doesn’t pay for all services, although the list of what is covered is fairly comprehensive. In that it determines what it will reimburse and at what rate, healthcare is controlled by the government. But not entirely controlled, as you point out.
Another aspect of having for-profit insurers wield such a powerful club is that they can literally force a hospital out of business by low-balling contracted reimbursement rates. When uninsured patients are billed, they are getting the full non-negotiated rate schedule.
Patients receive different levels of care quality, as well, based on their insurance coverage - or lack thereof.
While the Repubs spout off about other countries’ wait times and claim that the US doesn’t have that problem, I answer that’s because millions get no care at all and have been kicked out of the waiting queue. Once you factor in those who are denied care because of an inability to pay, the wait times increase dramatically.
What I go to are the numbers of preventable deaths and the amount of suffering that occurs as a direct result of this heartless, cruel non-system system.
“Caw…CAW!” ~ Sicko inspires grassroots action in Dallas cinema.
Scarecrow, Christy, Jane-any chance of getting Edwards, Obama, or even Hillary here for a chat about health care?
I’d be particularly interested in Edwards’ thoughts, given what Elizabeth is going through now.
Lou Costello @ 58
Oh, good, I meant to include that link but forgot. That’s similar to the reaction in Rayne’s post above. Thanks.
N=1:
You are well informed. You can write the book. I’ll provide the fan club and the cheering section!
Well, having been not insured at times, and insured, I’ll say this. The quality of care and interest in my health and whatever symptoms there may be was determined by whether or not I had an insurance card.
Just one quibble on an otherwise great piece, scarecrow. When you say “Americans will pay for it” you leave the impression that universal, taxpayer funded health care will be more expensive than the current system.
This is not likely. Removing the insurance company middle man, and negotiating with big Pharma on drug costs will have the effect of lowering costs. The US pays more per capita than any other OECD country because of the inefficiencies you cite. For most americans, the net effect on their paychecks will be an increase in take home pay, even with a tax increase to pay for universal health care–because their insurance premium will go away.
My issue with the current insurance driven system is that non-physicians are making medical decisions.
From the provider side of the table I can tell you there have been some real disasters because of this. And you have doctors spending time on the phone with insurers instead of seeing their patients.
masaccio @ 51
Morning all,
I’ve had two experiences where I needed emergency care in Russia…the first time I went to a EuroMed clinic and used my US insurance; the second time I went straight to a hospital and paid zip.
In neither place was I forced to fill out pages of intrusive personal info; all they asked about was allergic reactions to drugs and what meds i was currently taking.
We lost one good chance at single payer back in 1943, I believe, when the AMA organized a campaign against it.
mc @ 59
Good suggestion, and I know Jane, siun are working on getting the candidates here. We had Hillary to talk about women/equal pay issues, and Dodd has done these too.
For me, the scene that crystallized the problem we face in the US was the news footage of George Pataki speaking at Ground Zero committing $40 million to help 9/11 rescue workers, then spelling out all the exceptions, caveats, and clauses. It reminded me of those car dealer ads on the radio, when the fast-talking guy comes in at the end. Pataki couldn’t just say “We’re going to do the right thing by these people, no matter what.” The lawyerization and corporatization of American society has so bent us that we literally can’t do the right thing.
On July 4th I was at a picnic and started to discuss Sicko with a rabid wingnut. It was largely good-natured, but when I described the scene with Pataki. the guy immediately jumps in with the talking point “some of those people are cheats.” And, you know, he’s right, I do recall hearing stories of people trying to collect benefits who had nothing to do with the 9/11 rescue effort. But the fact that the right wing is so ready to discredit any effort to help people because “we’re ultimately paying for it with our already-high taxes” illustrates how successfully the health care and pharma companies have polluted the discourse. We can’t give people benefits because THEY cheat.
mc at 59 — We’re working on it. As you might imagine, they all have incredibly packed schedules, but we’re working on it…
As for the inevitable “you’ll have to wait — gasp! — a few weeks to have elective surgery!” scare argument:
Guess what? I’ve been waiting since 2002 for my insurance company to cover the best non-invasive treatment for my particular aggravating but non-life-threatening (if managed well) disorder. In fact, I’ve waited so long that I am no longer a suitable candidate for this particular treatment. (There’s hope on the horizon in the form of drug therapy, but the most effective drug happens to be RU-486, which the righties have fought to keep docs from prescribing for anything besides abortions; see, if word gets out that it’s useful for things besides terminating pregnancies, it’ll be harder to ban!)
I can’t tell you how amazing this is. As a former member of Capital Blue Cross management team, I recall having heated arguments with the CEO about Blue Cross being in the health care business and not the insurance business. I lost the argument and moved on. To see this reaching a national audience now- wow! Thank goodness for Michael Moore. Just sorry it took so long. The stories insurance company employees could tell! It isn’t pretty.
Your asking for a second political party.
We don’t have one.
The Democratic Party is little more than Republicans-lite.
And it’s high time we all faced up to that fact.
Every single one of the candidates is in the tank for Health Care Bandits — including Obama.
Do not forget that his lawyer defended the Irving’s jail-skipping.
N-1 @ 57:
On the provider side the only thing the government does is to ask if you will “accept assignment” or not. Psychologists, however, do not get a choice. You must accept what Medicare pays. So there are many psychologists who do not accept Medicare patients.
For doctors who choose “not to accept assignment” they can charge whatever they want and the patient must pay whatever Medicare does not pay.
So there is “choice” in Medicare if you’re a physician. And patients - beware!
jayackroyd @ 63
I didn’t say anything about relative costs; what you say seems intuitively correct, and I’ve seen articles that support it, but I honestly don’t know. My only point — drawing from the experience in other countries — is that this is such an important public service that people will pay for it. If it costs less than what we pay now for a clearly inferior system, all the better — in fact, that becomes a major selling point.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 68
What?! They’re too busy to hang out at the Lake? I’m shocked, I tell you, shocked.
*g*
David Ehrenstein @ 71
Dean’s not. Witness Vermont.
(By the way: Ironically, one of the few areas where Joe Lieberman is even remotely progressive was in certain facets of health care, and universal health care was a big issue for him. If Gore had been allowed into the White House in 2000, Lieberman and Dean may well have been tasked with working together on this.)
My Two Cents on “Sicko” nanoseconds after first seeing it last month
Dane Janeiro @ 67
Look at the incentive structure. If you need care, but you can’t get it, you have an incentive to “cheat” in ways that make you eligible. The solution is not to rail against or persecute cheaters but to change the structure to provide the care.
Scarecrow, this is a brilliant post. You are one seriously insightful Dog.
This is bedrock. And it informs this country’s whole approach to legislation and problem-solving. Up to and including how to deal with BushCo. “Start with the right question.”
Brilliant, I tell you.
oh, Good Morning, Christy. Please excuse my bad manners this morning.
More coffee please.
Because I had to see this again:
Rayne @ 15
Mr. Gore has this to say about the Libby deal:
“I thought it was improper,” Mr. Gore said of the decision. “He was charged with knowledge that could incriminate his bosses in the White House, which included the vice president and the president. I thought it was very disappointing.”
“Start with the right question.”
And the right question proceeds from the entire basis on which this society is constructed. Unless its changed there will be no change.
I’d much rather pay higher taxes for comprehensive health care for all than what we have now, a system that enriches insurance & pharma corps while americans get the shaft financially & healthwise.
If paying taxes for health care is damned as socialism by the privatization crowd then why aren’t they shouting about paying taxes for police and fire departments?
Just wanted to remind everyone that Libby had his sentence commuted. In case you forgot. Almost 80 posts and no mention of Libby….
This post is just excellent. Phenomenal work, scarecrow.
Well I’M sure !
Profit is a license to kill.
I want Karl Rove hauled into court so bad, I can taste it!
Oklahoma kiddo @ 80
Yup. (This is also what makes it light-years different from the Marc Rich pardon. Rich was pardoned for things he did in the 1970s, when Bill Clinton was still in Arkansas and the two men never worked for each other. Libby, on the other hand, was Cheney and Bush’s button man, sent out to do their dirty work.)
It should be obvious that the idea of health insurance is going to be screwed up from the get go-When it is in the insurers best interest to deny the claim, how can we have good health care?
In my business it so happens that the big bosses and owners of these health insurance companies are my customers. In case there was any doubt-they are fabulously wealthy. There is nothing wrong with that per se, but of course the money they have is derived from denied claims.