While President Bush was in Germany undermining a European plan for mandatory reductions in greenhouse gases, Democrats were meeting with automakers seeking to strip states like California of the authority to impose carbon emission reduction standards on autos sold in their states. And the auto moguls were even more interested in weakening proposed increases in mandatory gasoline mileage standards for autos, light trucks and SUVs. From Wednesday's NYT:
The chief executives of General Motors, Ford and Chrysler had lunch with Senate Democrats on Wednesday, less than a week before the Democratic leaders hope to bring a sprawling energy bill to the Senate floor.The executives argued that the bill’s proposal to increase mileage requirements for cars and light trucks would be impossible to meet and would gravely damage the automobile industry.
It would increase the average mileage requirement for passenger cars to 35 miles a gallon by 2020, up from 27.5 miles a gallon now, and would apply to light trucks and sport utility vehicles as well.
But leading House and Senate Democrats from Michigan are pushing a softer approach, and they have a good chance of getting some of what they want.
Senators Carl Levin and Debbie Stabenow, both of Michigan, are drafting a bill that would raise mileage requirements but would be more lenient for light trucks and would give car companies the possibility of an escape hatch by demonstrating that the rules would be too costly to meet.
The auto executives have fought for years to strip California of the right to set its own, more stringent auto emission standards, but the large California Congressional delegation and the State's governors of both parties have beaten back attempts to impose federal preemption. Because the Bush/Cheney regime has thwarted attempts to improve mileage and emission standards, except when forced by lawsuits, other states are now proposing to follow California's lead. This week, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi made clear she would oppose the industry/Administration's preemption attempts. With strong backing from Governor Schwartzenegger, California proposes to set auto emission standards aimed at greenhouse gases, not merely pollutants associated with smog.
Democratic leaders and even some Republicans have been promising to tackle global warming and reduce reliance on "foreign oil." They tell the American people these are matters affecting our national security, and they are right. But that's been true for decades, and yet there is still no serious effort to face the challenges and convince the public to make the necessary sacrifices.
It's been 30 years since the first Middle East oil embargo doubled oil prices, and the second embargo following Iran's seizure of US hostages quadrupled them again in the late 1970s. Since then, America has fought wars in the Gulf over oil; we've maintained large armies in the Middle East and a huge navy off its coasts. It is a very expensive energy policy whose real costs are not reflected at the pump, even when prices go over $3.00 a gallon.
Given this connection, it is ludicrous and dangerous to tell the American people we are becoming safer, as Hillary Clinton claims. Our increasingly belligerent military presence abroad has become the principal recruiting tool for people who think they're justified in flying planes into our buildings. When we invade and occupy their countries against their will, or bomb their cities, we create opponents willing to blow up our soldiers with IEDs. Now we're hearing that we may occupy a resentful Iraq for the next 50 years, and it's not because they want us there or anyone thinks Prime Minister al Maliki or Moktada al Sadr are swell democrats or because any thinking person believes that propping up a Shia coalition in Iraq is the best way to keep the Shia theocracy in Iran in check.
No, whatever excuses we use to fool ourselves, we're there primarily because the Bush/Cheney regime and those who think they're the real grownups believe that we have no choice but to do this as long as our economy runs on oil. These are the same grownups who think we don't have any economic choice but to accept, or at most deal slowly, with the unproven risks of global climate change, and they have plenty of shills and followers who believe this. In their grownup world, having 100 or more American soldiers killed every month in the Middle East is the only realistic energy policy we have. The thousands of local deaths simply don't matter.
The reason they believe this is because they think that we -- you and I -- will not accept higher energy prices, or smaller cars, or give up our SUVs. They think we won't pay a stiff tax to discourage gasoline consumption and support alternatives, or a tax on carbon emissions -- on coal -- to discourage emissions that cause climate change, or a cap and trade program to allocate capital to more efficient alternatives. They think conservation is just Jimmy Carter silliness, while better fuel efficiency would disrupt business as usual and isn't nearly enough anyway. And they think America is not willing or able to build a transportation system that doesn't require we behave as a militaristic empire.
And the worst thing about this? Too many of the people running for President in either party probably share those beliefs. I've watched the campaigns and debates, and there are some decent folks running, but frankly, none of these people seems to have much faith in us. They may talk about "energy independence" or the equivalent of Apollo projects to develop alternatives, but none of them is really telling us what needs to be done or asking for sacrifices or dramatic changes that would affect our lives. They don't believe you and I will elect them if they advocate that, and our media keep telling us that's true. Are they right?
I hope they're all wrong. I keep thinking that when America was really concerned about its security during WWII, American industries stopped building cars and appliances for consumers and built thousands of tanks, trucks, planes and ships; and when we were done with the War, industry switched back. Those were gargantuan industrial transitions, but America did them and did them quickly.
You'd think we could build a hybrid car that gets 100 mpg and doesn't require 100 KIA every month. And if the industry required that we remove the burden of paying for health plans in the price of every car, and solved universal health care some other way, well, I'll bet we could do that too. I think this country would surprise these wannabe Presidents; Americans are ready to be challenged. All they need is the right leadership.
Photo of best selling Ford Explorer, from Wikipedia.
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so, do we get to stop the silly zed stuff?
but the oil revenue from Iraq was going to pay for this splendid little war and we would have gas that was too cheap to meter at the pump, right?
Isn’t some of this what our favorite dartboard, Friedman, pushes for?
Good morning, everyone. What’s for breakfast?
Scarecrow @ 4
Didn’t you read the post - evidently, OIL
Cheap oil - too cheap to meter - all from the chimp’s splendid little war in Iraq
Good Morning Scarecrow!
Scarecrow @ 4
Cheerios!
If Fitzy is a runaway prosecutor…is
Cheney a runaway VEEP?
charlie tuna @ 6
Yeah, “too cheap to meter” was the motto for the nukes — I think GE dreamed it up. That’s how we got Ronald Reagan.
Elliott @ 8
How did you know? Blueberries on top.
Cheerios and whole wheat toast, bird-safe organic coffee with milk, fresh squeezed orange juice, and a heaping plate full of snark.
Good morning, pups…skritches and tummy-rubs all around…
but, forgive me:
Gawd for-fucking-bid that ANY Corporation should have to ’sacrifice’ anything in the name of the (to date) OVER 3500 US soldiers killed for OIL in Iraq (NB: i don’t give a fuck about mercs, living or dead)…
this news comports perfectly with the unstated but most impingent responsibilities USer legislators–Dims and Pukes alike–owe to their corpoRat masters…
.
Well, let’s see. We are retired and on a fixed income. We just got slapped with a $13,000 annual health insurance fee we can’t pay. Gas on the northern California coast is $3.55 per gallon. Yeah, I’m in a good mood this morning.
Organic flax and pumpkin seed cereal with an organic banana, fair trade certified organic coffee, 16 oz glass of water with liquid vitamins, minerals, ammino acids.
well, to cut the pols some slack… we didn’t react so well when jimmy carter tried to tell us we had to change our ways. drive at 55mph? that didn’t go over so well.
‘course that doesn’t excuse pols who refuse to lead… or worse, block the efforts of others.
This is a great article! There needs to be a lot more talk and thinking about energy in this country.
This is the same old pernicious bullshit that got us into the pickle we are in. Because guess what an SUV is? A light truck. And that is how they came to be in the first place. Back in the 70s, when the 1st mileage standards were written for cars (which is why you don’t see anymore 12 mpg Cadillacs or Lincoln sedans anymore) they made an exemption–with good intentions back then–for light trucks. Farmers, carpenters and the like needed them, or so the thinking went.
So the Big 3 figured out how to make the “light trucks” into fat-assed cars, hence the SUV. It took cheaper gas for them to really take off, but in the end it worked.
Levin should be ashamed of himself. And exemption for light trucks etc is more of the same old, same old.
I’ve always been a small car kinda guy. My first (and bestest most favorite ever) was a VW bug. Currently driving a (paid for) 92 Escort five-speed that gets over 30 mpg city driving.
OT but:
Happy Birthday Happy Birthday
Happy Happy Happy Birthday
Happy Birthday Happy Birthday
Happy Happy Happy Birthday
HA-ppy Birthday HA-ppy Birthday HA-ppy Birthday
To me!
And if you se any of these people of semi-fame today wish them Happy Birthday as well:
Bargoyle Bush
Joan Rivers
Boz Scaggs
Sonia Braga
Jerry Stiller
Nancy Sinatra
Kathy Baker
Julianna Margoulies
Keenan Ivory Wayans
Lindsay Davenport
Kim Clijsters
Kanye West
Maria Menounos
Scarecrow @ 11
Nope, honey-nut with a banana
sofistic @ 14
When California’s energy commission studied economic vulnerability back in the 1970s, one of the things we concluded was that the most important issue to solve wrt to an oil tax (or carbon tax) is what to do with the money. We concluded that because the tax on oil tended to be regressive — and hurt those on fixed incomes and/or livelihoods that depending on driving, we have to find a fair way to rebate part of the revenues back to those most impacted. The tax would have beneficial macro effects, but the micro effects had to be addressed. Prices dropped in real terms in the 1980s and all those studies just went up on the shelf.
Happy Birthday dakine!!!
Thanks for this excellent post.
The fact that we even debate increasing mpg standards all of 7.5 mpg over 12 years is ridiculous, and our Mich. senators should be told as much.
Next, Consumers Union hits the nail on the head when they talk of a strategic refinery reserve to go along with the oil reserve. Refining capacity is the immediate problem- the 800 lb. gorilla in the room nobody wants to address, but would bring immediate price relief at the pump.
It goes without saying we should accelerate our efforts into alternative fuels and conservation, but getting some US owned refineries on line post haste would slow down the price gouging that’s going on today.
Scarecrow @ 11
Why it’s the only way to start the day!
(except maybe having something to put maple syrup on)
Happy b-day dakine01!
Millineryman @ 15
I’m going to assume all that is in a bowl of Cheerios. I don’t want to hear the truth.
egregious @ 21
Even when times are at their suckiest, I always look on my b’day is a good day. ;})
Morning Scarecrow et al.
I get to meet S.O.S. finally for lunch today—going light on the breakfast.
don’t de-fang strong legislation! it’s what we need…
dakine01 @ 18
HAPPY BIRTHDAY dakini!
“It is a very expensive energy policy whose real costs are not reflected at the pump, even when prices go over $3.00 a gallon.”
True. And the higher price isn’t going to the government, which is paying at least the military part of the externalities. It just gets sucked up by Big Oil and oil-producing nations. A gas tax at least helps match the cost with the payer.
Another serious risk facing us is that some nations are going to start pricing oil in Euros, or some basket of currencies. Then the horrid mis-management of the economy by the Bushies will come home to roost. As the dollar declines against the Euro or the basket, which it certainly will, the price of oil will go up for us and not for Europe, or nations with currencies in the basket. Our economy will be weakened with no effort on the part of the sellers. Iran has threatened to do this already.
But note: this will not affect the rich, whose assets are no longer tied to the US economy. By virtue of international investments, they will suck on our economy like a wasp larva on a caterpillar until it is a husk.
Who are the Dem’s who are sucking up to the big 3 now. We should pull together a list and start pressuring them. I know the folks from MI are in a bind on this but frankly, even they should not by the “not technically feasible” crap Detroit issues every time they are pushed. If they spent more energy on engineering and less on obstruction we would have safer cars that got well over 50 mpg by now. The irony is that not meeting this challenge will be the most likely cause of their demise.
They could make an SUV that got 100 MPG, but that would require their CEOs and other top officers to slash their perks and profit-takings by 90%. And they would much rather maintain their perks than preserve their companies — after all, THEIR platinum parachutes are safe.
My first NEW car was a 1977 Honda Civic Hatchback that got well over 30 mpgs. It wa a teeny tiny car, but I loved it.
Before that I had a series of 2nd hand VW bugs and Saab hatchbacks (3 gears on the steering column!)
What’s Detroit going to give us next, a car that runs exclusively and directly on the blood of American soldiers?
I mean, gasoline/oil is finite, but there’ll always be American soldiers, right?
(/sarcasm)
You know what would turn around American auto makers and get them to drill down even tighter on MPG?
Universal healthcare.
As long as automakers have to pay more than 25% the cost of a vehicle in healthcare benefits, they are going to push back hard on MPG demands because they can’t afford it. Faced with double-digit increases in healthcare expenses for workers year after year during this administration, they simply cannot make progress. GM alone lost tens of billions last year; they can’t stay in business doing that, nor can they fund the R&D necessary to make high MPG vehicles that the public demands; they are in a bind.
This is not a popular opinion or position, but it’s the reason why Chrysler ultimately got sold off; it’s damned hard to make a profit in the auto business if the competition has an automatic 25 to 30% advantage subsidized by the government. Nor is the auto business the only industry so affected in this country; countless small-medium-large businesses hang by a thread because of healthcare as it is currently structured in this country.
Perhaps the question isn’t merely whether we would be willing to make greater sacrifices in regards to energy consumption, but in regards to healthcare. Isn’t a threat to our national security if we continue to lose our manufacturing capacity because we have such a crappy methodology for healthcare delivery financing?
Selise, Scarecrow and I had a long talk about this last weekend—about the nation’s will and the first Apollo project. That was when we had an executive branch of government that believed in governing, not in pillaging.
During the DNC in 2004 the Apollo Alliance was doing workshops on how we need (and they are working on) a 10 year plan to make us energy independent. The excuse that Detroit et al keep giving is how changing over would cost jobs and kill the economy. The AA anticipates it would create 3 million jobs. If the citizens of the US had the will to do it, we certainly have the talent. Scarecrow’s point about the major industries re-tooling for WW II illustrates that.
This whole issue makes me crazy. It’s as if the government was trying to sell us on eating cheeseburgers, fries and super premium ice cream as the way to lose weight.
dakine01 — Happy Birthday; you’re the most famous person on that list.
Also, honey nut is cheating, but just today, we’ll let is slide.
Phoenix Woman — don’t know why you’re so cynical about a group of CEOs that have essentially missed the biggest industrial opportunity in a century while running their companies into the ground and destroying thousands of jobs. Why shouldn’t they be rewarded?
The thing that is so sad about all of this is that it is possible to produce efficient cars, and to produce them at an affordable price. If there were only the political will. I suppose it will take a massive Great Depression to wake people up.
I just got back from Europe, where I rented a car. It was a small Volvo D50, a hatchback with a diesel motor. Diesel is 1.14 Euro per liter (about $6 a gallon), compared with 1.45 Euro per liter for gasoline (about $8 per gallon).
The car got 41 mpg. Low sulfur diesel is becoming available for .1Euro more.
masaccio @ 30
I laugh now but I cried the first time it cost me $3.00 for a tank of gas in my old bug back in the seventies. It was such a rip-off! Of course this was back when gas was usually .25 or .26 cents a gallon and if you knew where there were multiple stations on opposite corners, ya could find gas wars where it would go down to .15 or .16 per.
Of course, I also remember buying cigarettes for .22 per pack.
Many Happy returns Dakine
I have an old Subaru Forrester that does Ok Been looking at the Prius which starts at 22K. I guess Ill nurse my old car along for a while longer.
I bet Toyota, Nissan and Honda are licking their chops. I guess no one has told the Michigan congressional members that the Asian imports are gaining market share at a record pace because they are producing vehicles with higher fuel efficency.
I thought Democrats fought for the workers and not big business. By allowing the US Auto manufactures to continue the status quo will eguate to more lost manufacturing jobs.
Speaking of reasons to be cheerful.
NYC’s Mayor Bloomberg is planning to institute “Congestion Pricing” in lower Manhattan, where the traffic and the air quality is abysmal.
It will cost $8 for every car and $21 for every truck that travels below 86th street. The revenue will be put back into the public transit system, which desperately needs to be upgraded and expanded.
Here is the link to a NY Times article — really worth reading.
Woodhall Hollow @ 33
yep.
my ‘85 accord got about 35 mpg. kept that car 17 years and then bought a ‘02 civic of about the same size. it gets about 35 mpg. and i hope it also lasts 17 years.
we need to find a Moore’s Law in transportation efficiency.
sofistic @ 14
Ow ow ow!
Scarecrow @ 37
Hey it least I didn’t move to frosted.
Besides, as a kid, cheerios was usually my dessert and reward for cleaning up my plate. Either that or a slice of bread, buttered and sugar sprinkled on top.
ABC had a story on evening news that sparked this post, but I can’t find the video. Here’s a companions story on line.
Phoenix Woman @ 32
And while I’ve taken the unpopular position on automakers here in the thread, I’ll take the equally unpopular (with CEO’s) position that ALL CEO’S MAKE TOO MUCH MONEY in the U.S.
There is no good reason for a CEO to earn a salary more than 10X any lowest level line worker in an organization. You want to reward a solid CEO’s performance? dole it out in stock, and based on three benchmarks: sales, customer satisfaction and employee satisfaction.
I wish there was a way to legislate this.
If we could afford an all electric vehicle, we would get one in a heartbeat, but we can’t, and probably the bulk of people are in the same situation.
Rayne @ 35
I agree with this 100%.
Nicely said, Scarecrow.
Outside of the gas milage standards, there are some really simple ideas of conserving that would go far in cutting down our oil use. How about a national campaign that has everyone checking their tires to make sure they’re pumped up right. That alone would save billions and cost virtually nothing. It just needs a President to stand up and talk about it, make it an issue.
Don’t count on Bush. Just talking about Global Warming gave Bush a stomach ache today.
Rayne @ 35
Ford’s actually pushing for national healthcare for the very reasons you mention. Too bad they didn’t start doing this in the 1990s, when Hillary’s national healthcare proposal was attacked and killed (with the “liberal” NYT leading the charge largely because Howell Raines hated and hates the Clintons for some unspecified reason).
IrishJim @ 42
where EVER did you get that idea?
IrishJim @ 42
You do know how many union jobs hang on the automakers here remaining in business, yes?
How many jobs would have to be cut to pay for the R&D to increase the MPG of vehicles to 100 MPG within 5 years, 10 years?
It’s a lot more complex than it seems on the face of it.
Oh, and let’s not forget legacy costs — all those millions of auto workers who’ve retired and are still drawing healthcare…how many of them do we cut off to pay for the R&D?
sofistic @ 49
My best friend’s father, who was an electrician, converted their family car from gasoline to electric in the 1970’s, and it didn’t cost much. The technology has been around for decades.
masaccio @ 39
Lessons everywhere, and then our President goes over there to lecture them on energy/warming policy.
Americans think that their freedom includes the right to drive whatever car they want, with whatever crappy gas milage it gets. It’s right up there with the First and Second Amendment.
RevDeb @ 36
i love this idea for a lot of reasons… one being that it seems like the perfect way to “buy off” the arms manufacturers that profit from war.
give them all nice big gov contracts if they will retool from weapons to alternative energy and related technologies (transportation efficiency for example) and manufacturing.
we defang a major industry that lobbies for wars AND get us off oil dependency AND prevent a climate crisis.
what’s stopping us?
Rayne @ 48
Rayne, you make some excellent points about Health Care and CEO salaries.
I saw Lee Iacocca on Charlie Rose recently. He was saying that the unions are going to have to be willing to “shoulder some of the burden” to keep the big 3 in biz. I almost threw my book at the TV. The unions should get serious and say OK–we will, but ONLY if upper management takes some serious pay cuts. And that it be written into the contract that the auto makers begin to serious lobby for universal health care.
That would be an interesting union negotiation.
Rayne @ 48
In Japan, the difference between the CEO and his/her lowest-paid employee is around 8x. In America, it’s around 400x to 500x.
And people wonder why Japan’s been kicking our butts for the past three decades?
The Democrats in Congress are working on that — hearings on CEO pay/perks are coming up, and where hearings appear, legislation usually follows.
The only driving we do is to the grocery store or to the doctor’s office. We order clothes online, and grow a small garden. We have two old cars. One gets 21mpg, and the other gets 26mpg. We drive on average about 5-miles per day. (one of the advantages of being retired, I guess; at least we control our own place and time to do things)
Scarecrow: The Prius ($22,175.00) seems to be the Best Overall Value of the Year with an EPA-estimated combined city/highway 55 miles per gallon and an Advanced Technology Partial Zero Emission Vehicle rating. And, you could be eligible for a $2,000 federal tax benefit. I’d love this car. I was thinking of trading in my 2003 Ford for it. If Ford can’t do the same, I say screw em.
Woodhall Hollow @ 43
Thanks for the link. I think congestion pricing makes sense. Most people don’t know it, but congestion pricing is already in place for electricity in over half the country (the congestion is on the transmission lines leading into urban areas)– state regulators obscure this through average retail rates, but it’s there in wholesale prices.
selise @ 58
Yupper!
Right now? Probably the lack of funding (which would be easily remedied by rolling back Bush’s 2003 tax cut giveaways to the rich).
Good morning, from L.A. Excellent post, Scarecrow.
So many hybrids are appearing- even mighty lux car Lexus has one. Ford’s got one that’s an SUV called the Escape, so SUV lovers can forgo the gas sucking Explorers & Expeditions.
I bought a Prius in December. Best car I’ve had, not just for mileage, but maintenance & roominess. Tall guys sitting in the back or front always remark how roomy it is. For those who thought a Prius might be gutless going up steep hills- I can breeze the Conejo Grade going toward Thousand Oaks doing 65-70 (Angelenos know how steep that is!)
Many, many Prius & other hybrids seen on the roads here in SoCal. American manufacturers could really turn those slumping sales figures around by offering more & more of them…
BTW, regular is now $3.43 @ the local Mobil station near my house.
ccmask @ 62
I’ve driven a Prius, and I liked it. Cool car.
Why does my party keep trying to offend this Democrat. I am here talking spcifically about:
Democrats were meeting with automakers to consider stripping states like California of the authority to impose carbon emission reduction standards on autos sold in their states. And they were even more interested in weakening proposed increases in mandatory gasoline mileage standards for autos, light trucks and SUVs.
Who’s really behind the Democratic Party?
I was pumping gas back during the second embargo. People were in a panic because they could only buy gas every other day. (Tragic, I know) I actually had someone call a cop to force me to sell gas to him on his off day.
The cop told me I had to pump this guy’s gas. I politely asked the cop if he, as a municipal police officer had the authority to over ride a federal mandate, and have me pump gas for someone who had to go to a wedding.
The look on the police officer’s face was priceless. Evidently, when this joker called the police, he told the dispatcher that I refused to pump his gas, and he had a family emergency, which was an out for people who really needed gas. I’m sure the police office didn’t like what I asked him, but his displeasure for being tricked by this joker made him more uncomfortable. He talked to the guy privately, and they both left without me pumping the gas.
This was before Raygun and his greedy, self-empowerment mantra took over a large portion of America’s heart and soul, which is now available at a big box retailer I suppose.
Rayne @ 48
legislate that 50% of the board of directors must be employees (representing all pay scales). i think germany and/or france do something like this?
our corporations are organized and run in the most anti-democratic ways. really virtually totalitarian in many cases. that’s bad, not just for it’s own sake, but for how it conditions us to accept the corporate forms of power distribution.
anything we could do to make our corporations more democratic institutions would be a good thing, imo.
There was an article in the local paper about someone who got a special dispensation in California to run a “Smart Car,” and other people just thought it was a toy car and weren’t interested.
Phoenix Woman @ 52
Unfortunately it’s taken a generational shift in management and a corporate near-death experience for Ford to make “bold moves“.
I really wish that more FirePups could spend some time in the Rust Belt, actually in the bowels of the automakers. It would really open your eyes.
I had an interview with a consulting firm that provided telecom-related services to GM; I reported to a building that was still called an R&D facility, even though the R&D was long gone. When I got there, I saw THOUSANDS of desks in a massive cube farm; the firm with which I interviewed pointed out the different sections, saying, This is our competitor X (another consulting firm) and this is our competitor Y (yet another consulting firm)…
I never saw or met a single employee of GM the entire time I was on site. The entire services portion of the corporation had been outsourced in order to reduce operating expenses. And the consulting firm with which I interviewed explained each of the firms on site were constantly watching each other, trying to get the competitive jump on pricing and services in order to retain their contract with GM.
Most people in the U.S. have absolutely no clue how much has already been cut from automakers in the last 20 years.
dakine01 @ 26
You must be young!
Scarecrow @ 63
I worked in Manhattan for most of Y2K and there was no way in hell that I would drive in that city. I took Amtrak in from Hartford on Mondays and home on Friday and used the subway most of the time (cabs usually to and from Penn Station). Way too many buses, trucks, and cabs double parked and blocking things…
Oklahoma kiddo @ 67
I should probably clarify that it was the automakers seeking these restrictions — most Dems are skeptical, but Michigan Dems tend to be more sympathetic, for understandable reasons.
the golden rule will never die. i think you know what i’m talkin about.
There’s an old cliche (and a song back in the 60s) that you’ve got to be cruel to be kind. The proposed legislation would force Detroit to face its competition, but they’re hooked on the “Big car, big profit” mentality. California’s fuel economy standards would do to the automakers what the drug laws did to Robert Downey; force them to confront their problems.
selise @ 58
That’s a fresh perspective, for me, on an idea I already like.
Scarecrow @ 25
Of course it was.
Happy Birthday dakine01! Celebrate and have fun.
Selise–that is an excellent point re boards. And another possible point of negotiation for unions who are being asked to make sacrifices to save jobs. Demand that a certain number of board seats be given to employees. They could be elected by unions.
May I have a word with you? Gore.
raven @ 72
Double nickle today…
When I lived in Manhattan I drove a Simca. I think it was a Swedish car. It was so tiny but parking in garages was costing me a small fortune. Anyway, one evening I met some friends down in Wall Street for a drink and had a couple too many. When I came out, I couldn’t find where I’d parked it. Took a cab home and never looked for it and never heard from anyone about it. I always wonder what happened to it. Probably someone put it in their purse. It was very small and there are some very big purses in the city :)
dakine01 @ 81
Younger than me but not that young! I lost interest at about 50. I guess gong in the Army on my 17th always made it sort of a mixed day anyway. Get on some of dakine and enjoy!
Woodhall Hollow @ 79
I have a problem with this, to an extent.
At the risk of pissing off some folks and getting flamed very badly: the very reason that unions have not been able to use leverage they already have is that the substantive majority of union folks have absolutely no f*cking clue how to run a business and make a profit.
None. I rub shoulders with and count among my dearest friends some of these union folks, but they are not business people. There’s a reason they didn’t go to business school.
I think it would be much better for unions to catch a clue and take a page from CalPers. Look at the power that CalPers has on not only individual corporations in which it is invested, but on the entire market; had the UAW, AFL-CIO and Teamsters pursued that model with retirement funds, they could have clamped down on the auto industry one helluva long time ago. And they would have done it through analysts managing their monies who actually are strong business people.
Judge Moonbox @ 76
Actually that was Nick Lowe in the mid-late seventies:
Chorus:
You’ve gotta be
Cruel to be kind in the right measure,
Cruel to be kind it’s a very good sign,
Cruel to be kind means that I love you,
Baby, you’ve gotta be cruel to be kind.
ccmask: heh, I had a Simca back in the 1970’s. Weird car, but fun. A French car, BTW.
the same folks who are behind the GOPukes…
Another reply supplied for you by the DSOA (Dept. of Short, Obvious Answers)…
Great post, scarecrow.
I think Obama actually had good proposal last year where the govt would assume some of the auto companies’ legacy costs if they agreed to improve fuel efficiency.
Having the Michigan senators write the fuel efficiency bill is insane at this point in time, we might as well let Exxon do it. Sounds like the greater needs of the country are once again being held hostage to the blue dogs and their wilingness to join with republicans to fuck us all.
I really never want to hear the word ‘moderate’ again.
Phoenix Woman @ 64
or maybe just take some of the money now going to pentagon budgets… and redirect it. same companies get the money - just for different projects.
do we really need the V-22 Osprey?
p.s. i want to use the tax cut roll backs for universal single payer health care. :-)
sofistic @ 86
Speaking of weird European cars, has anyone seen a Smart Car? They are all over Europe–as wide as a normal compact car, but really short–a 2 seater with a little storage space in the back. Great for city driving, can fit into a half a parking space. I have driven one in the UK–they are great!
Judge Moonbox @ 76
Who is it that is actually hooked on “big cars, big profit”?
Some assholes are actually demanding Hummers, can’t make enough of them, instead of buying smaller vehicles; who are these people sending the wrong message to GM?
Some assholes are actually demanding more profitability from their stock every quarter, and screaming at the boards of directors to sell the company if they can’t get the job done; who are these people?
They are not auto industry executives. I suspect that a few Democrats might take a closer look at their garage, their investments and then the mirror.