I invited Tom Schaller (author of Whistling Past Dixie) here today to discuss his recent article in the Baltiore Sun because I think what he's saying is extremely important and deserving of much more attention, especially as we head toward the '08 election and misguided pollsters seem to be urging Democratic candidates into a "center" which Schaller contends no longer exists.
I'm going to quote extensively from the article here because I can't say it any better:
We are fast approaching a critical moment in American politics. To fully appreciate what's happening, you need only to understand the difference between a camel and a dromedary.
The one thing media talking heads agree upon is that the center prevails. Turn on almost any of the nation's political talk shows and pretty soon somebody will say how crucial it is for politicians to appeal to registered independents and self-described moderate voters.
They conjure for us an image of the distribution of the American electorate as that of a dromedary's single hump with a large, vital center of thoughtful citizens in the middle, flanked by a downward-sloping share of shrill, radical liberals on one side and grumbling, reactionary conservatives on the other.
In fact, the American electorate has for some time been bifurcating into two rather distinct camps, with fewer centrist voters. The true image is that of the two-humped camel.
On a panel at a Chicago convention of political scientists recently, Emory University's Alan Abramowitz explained what's happening.
"Independents made up 35 percent of the 2006 voters, more than either Democrats or Republicans," Mr. Abramowitz said, based on his analysis of data from the 2006 Cooperative Congressional Election Study. "But most of these independent identifiers were not true swing voters - most of them leaned toward one party or the other, and these leaning independents voted overwhelmingly for their preferred party."
Mr. Abramowitz added this key point: "Moreover, Democratic leaners were just as liberal as other Democrats, and Republican leaners were just as conservative as other Republicans."
Sure, millions of Americans refuse to register with either of the major parties, and they avoid the labels "liberal" or "conservative" to describe themselves ideologically. But what matters more than how they fill out registration forms at their county board of elections or define themselves when pollsters call is the policy opinions and attitudes they espouse and how those opinions translate into votes.
On that score, Mr. Abramowitz demonstrates that not only are liberals and conservatives voting more predictably for Democrats and Republicans, respectively, but their social and economic attitudes are becoming more internally consistent. He says it is easier today to predict, say, how a voter feels about stem cells based on her position on tax policy.
"To a much greater extent than in the past, voters' opinions on economic, cultural and foreign policy issues are closely interconnected with Democrats overwhelmingly on the liberal side of almost every issue and Republicans overwhelmingly on the conservative side of almost every issue," Mr. Abramowitz says.
America seems to be coming to the end of a period of partisan dealignment that began with the civil rights movement and the Vietnam War. The so-called vital center is collapsing.
This completely flies in the face of every bit of conventional wisdom (meager though it is) floating around DC which says that the Democrats should stand for nothing, limp toward the center and throw a "big tent" over every principle so as not to "alienate" a constituency it appears does not really exist. Cue the GOP:
Republicans figured this out years ago. Before the 2000 recount had concluded, Bush campaign pollster Matt Dowd wrote Karl Rove a game-changing memo in which Mr. Dowd marveled that the center of the American electorate had disappeared. They had expected split-ticket voters to account for about one-quarter of the electorate, but the figure was closer to 6 percent.
Mr. Rove promptly announced he would target for mobilization millions of evangelicals who did not turn out to vote in 2000.
Bush is monumentally unpopular, the Republicans are still trying to shake off the '06 whipping they got, and yet witness each of the candidates in the GOP debates competing to be more extreme, more authoritarian, more torture lovin' and woman-hating than the next ("double Guantanamo?" Did he really say that?) Not a one of them trying to enfranchise some mythical centrist vote. They know where the numbers are.
Now I realize that it's probably easier for the GOP to come to grips with the fact that their future rests with white males than for Democrats to acknowledge that theirs doesn't. Witness this report by Third Way (PDF) (summed up by Chris Cillizza here ) which concludes that the future of the Democratic party rests with "white, higher-income, male and rural voters." Schaller effectively dismantles this balderdash here, but the report is embarrassing in its short-sighted, shallow massaging of statistics to achieve a conclusion that is breathtaking in its ignorance.
Schaller has another piece up today in the Sun which asserts that single women are a "sleeping giant" for the Democratic party, something we've been pushing for a long time (and a bandwagon onto which Hillary Clinton climbed yesterday).
Schaller:
Whether they are divorced, separated, widowed, not yet married, or legally prevented from marrying their same-sex partner, almost half of all American women over 18 are unmarried. Soon they will be a majority.
But turnout among unmarried women - just 59 percent in the 2004 presidential cycle - was significantly lower than the 71 percent rate among married women. In the 16 states where Women's Voices ran targeted mobilization campaigns, however, the rate of increased turnout for what the group prefers to call "women on their own" was twice the rate of increase in the other 34 states.
Everybody knows Democrats fare better among women than men. But Republicans win among white women and married women.
Even in 2006, the best Democratic midterm cycle since 1974, Republicans narrowly won both groups.
The Democrats' gender gap thus derives from the party's wide support among unmarried women and nonwhite women. In fact, in 2006 unmarried women chose Democratic congressional candidates by the eye-popping margin of 66 percent to 32 percent.
Along with union households and racial minorities, these unmarried women helped the Democrats erase Republican majorities in Congress, among governors and in the state legislatures.
After the election, Greenberg Quinlan Rosner Research conducted a poll for Women's Voices of 1,000 unmarried American women. They found that unmarried women are particularly motivated by "an agenda for change," specifically on issues related to health care and ending the war in Iraq.
"It is clear that these women can and should be reached," the report stated about the 20 million such women who are either unregistered or who are registered but do not vote. "By gender and marital status, they are the largest group on the sidelines of democracy, and they have an agenda that calls for major change."
Attitudes among unmarried women are hardly monolithic. Younger and minority women, who are less likely to vote, especially in off-year congressional cycles, are more concerned with education and employment issues. Not surprisingly, older women express greater interest in the war, prescription drugs and pay equity.
What unifies this emergent bloc of potentially pivotal voters is their dissatisfaction with the direction of the country. They also have a dismal view of politicians and the political system: More than half say that politicians "don't listen to people like me," and almost half agree that "government doesn't do anything to solve my problems, whether I vote or not."
Social scientists call this phenomenon "low-efficacy." But Democrats should translate it into three words: huge electoral opportunity.
Please welcome Tom Schaller in the comments. His political insights are something that the DC establishment resists mightily, but the fact remains that there is a strong argument to be made that speaking to the progressive concerns of the party's base does not drive the Democrats over the liberal cliff but is rather the road that leads to electoral victory.
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Hi Tom! Welcome!
Welcome, Tom. Thanks so much for being with us today.
As with all chats, please stay on topic and take all OT comments to the previous thread.
thanks, all, and thanks especially to jane for inviting me and always supporting me and my work. she is, as we can all agree, a national treasure.
so, let’s get to debating….fire away when you’re ready!
I can well imagine that your conclusions have not been readily embraced by those who want to nudge the party into standing for nothing, but such “leadership” always sounds like the Unity ‘08 crowd — “the party can only survive if it agrees with me.”
Hi Tom and welcome.
I am wondering if this potential voting bloc could somehow be wooed in a manner similar to the fifty state model,your thoughts?
Jane Hamsher @ 5
Well, Jane, I find it interesting that Dems are always rewarded or legitimated by the conventionally wise and the talking heads when they move right, and the GOP is too when they move….right!
the country is polarizing, and that’s NOT a bad thing. we are, i hope, finally bifurcating into two, increasingly distinct parties and that, to borrow a phrase from a famous conservative, provides a choice rather than an echo.
What will it take to get the Democrats in Congress (and in the leadership elsewhere) to recognize that the moderates they keep trying to appeal to aren’t there any more, and that the base of the party is all to the left of them?
Bustednuckles @ 6
Sure, why not, although I haven’t dug deeper into the stats to see if there are state-level effects, thought surely there must be some. Obviously, widows are going to be more common in states with greater retiree populations, e.g.; on the other hand, younger states with young women may have unmarried women who are just not yet married b/c they are pursuing professional agendas and grad school and otherwise delaying marriage; and then states with high divorce rates (ironically, the southern states among them) will have high shares of unmarried women.
but, you’ve now given me more work to do!
Hi, Tom! Welcome to the Lake!
Your thesis is interesting, but I’m having trouble with it. First, I associate it too much with the wedge politics of Newt Gingrich and Karl Rove, so for starters its distasteful.
More importantly, however, it ignores a recent fact of over-riding importance: What do you do with the people who voted for Bush in 2000 and 2004, but who voted for Democratic representatives in 2006? Weren’t there millions of those?
I’d say that there are indeed two major voting blocks: Those who vote Democratic 95% of the time, and those who vote Republican 95% of the time. But I think that leaves a whole lot of people left over who don’t vote a straight party line. There are Greens, there are Libertarians, there are Independents, and there are plain old ticket splitters. I really think we ought to be paying more attention to them.
Bob in HI
P J Evans @ 8
It appears that the Joe Liebermans and the Unity ‘08 crowd who use disingenuous appeals to “bipartisanship” get more airtime than their constituencies deserve. Nice buzzwords that probably poll well but really have no political impact.
P J Evans @ 8
Well, for one thing, an occassional protest vote by the liberals and the Progressive Caucus wouldn’t hurt. Second, it will help that Media Matters and other groups are (finally, if slowly) convincing the natl media that there is a severe under-representation of liberal-progressive voices on radio and tv.
overall, it’s a self-feeding loop–more power means more voice and more votes which means more power. we’ve seen this model work for the conservative base of the GOP, and now it’s time to flip the script, as they say.
So then, it is not a good idea for any political candidate for any office to play to the ‘center’?
Tom,
What do you think of the economic populism or fairness message as a way to mobilize voters. Would you consider that just another way of moving to the center? Or is it a true progressive vision for America. It seems that a lot of the nascar types or white working class people can be moved by this. even in the south.(Webb in VA) or in the West (Schwietzer or Tester)
Hello and welcome!
How important is the platform of the party in the success of an individual candidate? For example, Landrieu is thought to be the most vulnerable dem senator- another victim of Katina perhaps. How important will the party platform (as negotiated at the convention) be in her success or failure?
Bob Schacht @ 10
Hey Bob in HI…with all due respect, don’t underestimate the power of wedge politics: they work. and right now i think the wedge issues, which used to work against dems, are working for them, including immigration, which is eating the GOP alive, and stem cell research.
the tip of the wedge is the progressive movement–dems should force the GOP to make hard choices between, say, religio-conservatives who hate stem cell research and their soccer moms; or cultural, english-only types who want giant border fences and wall street types who want cheap, dominatable labor supplies.
wedge politics work, and should work better if dems knew how to play tougher.
hey tom, billy here. how do we make this group of unmarried females who don’t tend to vote as much and as often start to vote more? and we still need to realize that the south is going to continue growing in population so we have to deal with it sooner or later! hopefully some of the growth will be in outsiders who are more favorable to our side!
Mr Schaller…
It seems to me that Third Way is really little more than a front group for investment bankers who are “liberals”. Heres the background of their board of trustees.. (financial industry background is bolded…the three people with no listed financial industry background are italicized.)
the founder and president of Cullman Ventures, Inc., a diversified corporation…..
oversaw investments in private equity funds and hedge funds…
Chairman of Millbrook Capital Management, Inc., a private investment firm…
Chairman and CEO of the Dyson-Kissner-Moran Corp., a privately owned, diversified investment holding company…
global head of equity trading for Goldman, Sachs…
has directed investments in industries [and was formerly an] investment banker at Quadrex Securities Group and an attorney specializing in corporate and securities law…
Chief Executive Officer of Vail Resorts [and formerly] associated with Apollo Management L.P., a New York based investment fund [and] in the Mergers and Acquisitions department of Drexel Burnham Lambert…
the first woman to achieve the rank of three-star general…
Managing Director and Co-head of the Global Financial Institutions Group at Morgan Stanley’s Financial Institutions Group…
President of Lincoln Center for the Performing Arts…
…partner at Bingham McCutchen LLP [and] developed legislative and regulatory strategies for clients involved in corporate mergers, professional and amateur sports, commercial aviation, utility and banking regulation, and legal process reforms…
President & CEO of the ONE Campaign [formerly] Chief of Staff to Senator Harry Reid…
one of America’s most innovative and successful mall developers…
responsible for all aspects of fund management, including manager due diligence, strategy analysis and asset allocation…
chairman and CEO of BLS Investments [and formerly] chairman of the board and chief executive officer of Loral Space & Communications Inc…
Chairman of StoneWater Capital LLC, a fund-of-funds management firm…
24 years of experience in venture capital and specialized equity investing…
active in the field of finance for more than 50 years…
one of the leading attorneys practicing in the merger and acquisition arena…
Third Way’s administrative management is heavy on former officials at Americans for Gun Safety, which bills itself as a “bringing a new, centrist perspective” [not progressive perspective] to the gun control debate. Its talking points on the Estate Tax instruct progressives to pretty much ignore the estate tax, and concentrate on other issues. And one need only look at their New Rules Report and its criticism of what it calls “neo-progressives” to see the clear pro-corporation bias of Third Way.
Given the need for funding of a multitude of pre-existing truly progressive “think tanks”, would we be justified in suspecting that Third Way is “faux-progressive” and was created a little over two years ago primarily to advance the interests of the financial industries.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 13
I think every time we get “sista soulja’d” it plays into right wing narratives and disempowers and fragments the base. It may reap short-term political gain for a particular candidate but if I understand what Tom is saying it does nothing to build a strong, solid constituency that will support the Democratic party consistenly over time.
His article indicates that single women don’t think anyone speaks to them. They are overwhelmingly progressive. That’s a problem.
Tom, What happened to the middle? Was it ever there? If so, where did it go and why?
“the center” is, of course, a logical fiction. The degree to which a candidate is seen as LEFT RIGHT or center depends on their position on a variety of issues.
Should a congressional candidate in rural Idaho take a position in favor of gun control?
Willie Stark @ 14
No, no, no….I don’t think economic populism is moving the center. I just don’t think it will work as well in the (white) south, and for two reasons—racial polarization and low unionization. but here’s a quick excerpt from a piece I wrote not long ago in response to Bob Moser (whom I respect) aftet his Nation piece last fall:
The problem, however, is that the transformation Moser envisions is easier to prescribe than effect. The reasons are manifold, but space permits me to handle just two: race and unionization.
Moser brushes quickly past race, a curious oversight given that most every study of political tolerance (racial or otherwise) reveals a strong, positive relationship between socioeconomic status and tolerance. As Steve Jarding and Dave “Mudcat” Saunders painstakingly chronicle in Foxes in the Henhouse, poverty in the rural white South is both appalling and appallingly resilient. Combine high poverty rates with their concomitant lower levels of racial tolerance, mix in residual tensions from the civil rights movement, and you understand why the poorest region of the country is the most Republican–despite the massive head start African-American voters provide Democrats.
In fact, analyses of the 2004 National Election Study reveal that neither attitudes on national defense nor abortion explained the Republican presidential preferences of white Southerners; negative racial attitudes did. How else to explain that in Mississippi, where poor whites and blacks live alongside each other, the former vote overwhelmingly Republican while the latter just the opposite? If economic populist appeals were unmediated by race, such glaring polarities simply could not exist.
Organized labor’s meager presence in the South also reduces the appeal of economic populism. For the past half-century, the Southern states have consistently ranked among the least unionized. The GOP’s chokehold on working-class white males is significantly weaker among retirees, union members and those living in union households. Because labor leaders organize voters around populist themes, their relative absence makes the “old South” economic appeal a much harder sell.
In 2006 nonunion-household voters split between the parties (49 percent each), but union households broke for the Democrats 64 percent to 34 percent. Connect this fact with low Southern unionization and, sure enough, in their party’s best midterm cycle in thirty-two years, Democrats carried every region but one–the South, which they lost by eight points, according to exit polls.
paul lukasiak, you are a treasure
I’m curious about the notion of “Moderate” vs the notion of someone being true to their beliefs.
I think the Dems get pilloried (and rightly so, I think) for abandoning their beliefs to find common ground, when there are times that the common ground is noxious and you need to stand fast to your principles. I also believe that people respect those who have principles and stand by them. (I think it got Bush re-elected because he seemed to have a spine and Kerry, sadly, did not.)
So, after that wordy build-up, is part of the issue that not only are people flocking to the edges of the political spectrum, but that they are intolerant of those who don’t have any idea where they stand?
Hi, Tom. I think your two-humped camel describes me pretty well–I am not, and do not anticipate ever being, registered as a member of a political party. This is not because I think both of the big parties are the same (although there seem to be more Democrats who want to play at being Republicans than vice versa!). Rather, I see too much historical pattern of corruption when any political party gains the ascendancy to really feel happy about offering that degree of support. But, I invariably choose the Democratic candidate in any two-way race, and my personal politics are somewhere in a Gandhiesque neighborhood.
I won’t copy P.Lukusiak’s whole post, but shit–even I had not bothered to look at who’s who behind Third Way. Very, very revealing.
Incidentally, I sent a personal email to JIm Kessler and Ann (forget her last name) at Third Way telling them that I was taking issues with their report, and that they should feel free to reach out to me directly. I fight hard, but fair.
So far, no word as of yet.
I’m also having lunch next monday with Bill Galston, who i respect but with whom I have some fundamental disagreements. Lunch was set up but mutual friend Jon Rauch, who is not partisn but is generally centrist. I hope to persuade them they’re a few years behind in their narratives. The both believe the center is huge and meaningful.
rwcole @ 21
“The center” is also defined by the person or group speaking about or defining it. Faux News has a much different assessment than KO.
So I can equate the over dramatization of the center to be as actual as the proverbial 200 MPG carburetor?
Hi Tom, welcome to the Lake. I have been saying for some time the more people would vote Dem if there was actually a Dem candidate, not just Republican lite. And it seems that you have numbers to support my admittedly not scientific gut feelings.
In my experience, the grassroots hunger and thirst for a real alternative. But over and over I see a the ‘grownups’ in the Dem party giving us nice, polite, moderate candidates. I am beginning to feel that this is not simply resistance to change. Do you have any sense that this is so, or where it might be coming from?
Mutant Poodle @ 24
AHHHHH…THIS IS EXACTLY THE POINT. One person’s definition of “moderate” differs from another’s. Giving people just three choices–liberal, conservo or mod–on a poll almost automatically steers a whole bunch of folks toward “moderate.”
but the real question is “what do people, no matter their label of self-description, think or believe?” the answer is that a majority of moderates are really liberals who prefer not to call themselves moderates.
read this powerful piece by my good friend Paul Waldman:
http://www.prospect.org/cs/art....._moderates
hey tom, billy again. back in the 06 elections, much was made of the fact that quite a few of the Dem new winners were from a more moderate wing of the party, such as Shulers win in NC, and they got elected by appealing to social traditional, almost conservative voters, rural folks. if we polarize to the 2 ends, how do we keep them on our side?
tom schaller @ 26
Go on.
JANE!!! - hey tom welcome to the lake
No one I know is in the center. They are on one side or the other. I think rwcole is right when he says it is a logical fiction. It is where “the wise men of Washington” think they are when they pontificate to the rest of us. Like so much else in media it is a construct which we are in the process of tearing down.
Tom. Welcome to FDL on behalf of us pups. Glad to see you in my local paper (we got a typo upstairs). I’m hoping that both parties will appeal to their bases: Republicans to warmongering country-clubbers and Dems to everyone else. Ought to be an interesting race, especially if we have several impeachments going on at once.
Have we stalled out? IF so, I’m entitled to make shameless plugs:
Barring edits that leave me on the cutting room floor, I should be quoted as part of a segment taped today for this Saturday’s CBS Evening News on 2008 and the significance of the South. Check it out!
I am interested in seeing Mary Bono knocked off in the California Desert. She is in a district that has a three percent republican advantage according to Cook. How can a dem candidate take her on successfully. Will the successful candidate position themself to her left on all major issues- or try to blur differences on all issues but the one they choose to run on?
In other words, how do actual politicians running in actual races make use of the two humped camel metaphore?
I find this topic very interesting.
The center seems a dull and flaccid place to live.
if the dems would be DEMS all this talk would become moot - dems will never be overwhelmingly elected if they equivocate and try to run as repugs-lite….
tom schaller @ 22
I like to think that the base of my party, the Democratic Party is left of center, or if you will “progressive”. Is my perception on target? This is a serious question. A very serious question, for one who is just about feed up with his party.
Tom, I live in the south, but was raised in the bluest of northern states. I would be very pleased to see the South become irrelevant in terms of national politics. We as a country have been held hostage by these thugs since reconstruction. Can we please let go of the 19th Century, people?
Gnome de Plume @ 34
The real key finding in Alan Abramowitz’s new study is how much greater correlation there is now between the SOCIAL and ECONOMIC dimensions of the public. That is, there used to be more of what we called libertarians (conservative on economics, liberal on social issues) and what we might call traditionalist progressives (just the reverse). so, while it was always pretty easy to figure out where somebody stood on choice based on where they were on gay rights, but not where they stood on choice based on tax cuts, it’s increasingly easier to discern voters’ social positions from their economic opinions and vice versa.
all of which means that not only is the center collapsing b/c of bifurcating coalitions, but each coalition is more INTERNALLY cohesive and consistent. like i said, good news for those of us who want a system with two, strong, distinct parties. (with one stronger than the other!)
Welcome, Tom.
How do I go about persuading women to register to vote?
What I hear over and over is “my one vote doesn’t matter” and “all politicians are dirty” and “the election is fixed anyway.”
Jane Hamsher @ 23
fools gold, perhaps ;)
****************
Tom, it seems to me that the idea that there is not much “center” to speak of is based in large part on the lack of ticket splitters.
Could this phenomenom not be attributable to the lack of a center, but rather to the sense that the parties themselves are increasingly polarized, and that there is a “center” that will change their “party line” vote based on which party is more to their liking?
It seems to me that the Pacific Northwest tends to lean liberal Dem as Bush gets waxed evry chance we get.
Saying this , I see pockets of die hard Republicans here and there.
Could it be feasable for a Dem to use your observations to succesfully pull moderate Repubs across the line?
What would you recommend as a strategy?
Thanks for stopping by.
Why are ‘Democratic-leaning independents who vote Democratic’ (and Republicans on the other side) labeled ‘Independents’ at all? Doesn’t the fact that they vote Democratic pretty much make them Democrats? Especially if the concept of ticket-splitting is as much of a fiction as it seems? Who are these ‘independent voters?’
the center is for those with backbone imo stand for something - already they’re backing off bench marks to end the war
Willie Stark @ 40
Seems a bit dangerous to speak about “the south” in global terms. Florida is different- Virginia is different. North Carolina is different. Arkansas is different- and so is Louisiana..
Dem candidates can and have won in these states- and in many cases things are moving in their direction.
There are votes there that should not be abandoned.
Margot @ 44
Margot, when I hear this I tell the person that that is exactly what they want you to think. They made it dirty and unappealing so that you won’t pay attention and won’t vote.
Tom Schaller 30 — that Waldman article is interesting:
Then you hear Chuck Schumer saying stuff like:
You have to wonder who he’s appealing to, and at what cost.
I remember in 2004, when I was in charge of the county precinct structure. We were targeting single women then. But that consisted of making them the top priority calls–not in reaching out to them differently or with a tailored message. Kerry’s message, as it was, just wasn’t doing it. Had he emphasized a key issue for him–energy independence–we might have been better. I don’t know what else would have made these women get jazzed over Kerry’s canned presentation.
Part of which makes me think our emphasis needs to be on getting these women to primaries, not general elections. If we let the male CW-fans pick our candidate, no wonder that candidate isn’t going to appeal to the single women.
And then I think about knocking doors for Dean in IA. We got a lot of people–women and men–who were working night jobs who at least SAID they’d love to vote for Dean at a caucus. Of course, in IA, people who work nights are effectively disenfranchised, as are people who can’t/can’t afford to get a babysitter. What are the other institutional factors that make it a lot harder for this democgraphic to get involved early in the process?
tom schaller @ 36
We’ll keep an eye out. I’ll alert the Amato.
tommytimp @ 47
Well, keep in mind that “independent” in reference to voters is a BEHAVIORAL measure–it’s quite literally which party they register with; whereas “moderate” is an ATTITUDINAL measure. so, w/r/t to indies, we can say these people are registered Indy, but of course they either don’t have indy or third-party candidate to vote for, or when they do, still choose largely from the two majors. so, what really matters (just like the underlying attitudes of “moderates” is what matters) is their prevailing voting behaviors.
on that count, sure, indies are more likely to split tickets or crossover than registered Rs or Ds….but as alan abramowitz has shown, most are increasingly behaving (because voting, too, is a behavioral measure) like R’s or D’s when it comes to vote.
which, after all, is what really matters, at least insofar as elections and control of government is concerned. (it’s not everything, but it’s a big deal…you know, voting and shit.)
seriously, though, what matters most is how people vote–not how they register or describe themselves. if 10% of the population identify themsleves as “banana splits” but they voted uniformly democratic, which matters more?
The choice question is a very valid one to ask when trying to penetrate the South.
But with candidates like Rudy G. (pro choice) or McCain or Romney, neither of which are very strong on choice, at least from the perspective of those hard social conservatives who care enough about choice that it is their single issue …I like our chances.
the link to the Center for Rural Strategies poll is here: http://www.ruralstrategies.org.....006.2.html
And what about so called “moderates”. Is that the same as being in the center? When I ask my self-proclaimed moderate friends to define what exactly a moderate is, they come up with answers like ‘I’m conservative on some issues and liberal on others, and in between on most’. How do we deal with that?
Gnome de Plume @ 51
How to get women registered and voting? There’s lots of new ideas about this, and this is somewhat out of my field (pun intended) of expertise. but much of it has to do with individual contacting by, usually, other women. i would recommend consulting page gardner and the smart folks at Women’s Voices about this. I also know that, whatever else one thinks of hillary, her team is gearing up for one of the most amazing voter registration and mobilization drives for women (particularly under-35 women) in american history. if she runs, that is a major upside of her candidacy.
Willie Stark @ 56
Thanks, WIllie. Rock on…
RANDOM SCHALLER PREDICTION:
IF WE HAVE A SAME-STATE GENERAL ELECTION MATCHUP, IT’S MORE LIKELY TO BE TENN V. TENN THAN NY V. NY.
emptywheel @ 53
And what do you think is the best way for candidates to try and enfranchise single women voters? Or is it anything that they can effect? Is it going to be more of an infrastructure problem?
I appreciate Hillary Clinton going after them, and her position as a woman does help, but her message is often not necessarily in line with issues that single women care about. Is anyone going to be able to speak to this constituency enough to make them believe that they have a voice?
tom schaller @ 60
Bingo!
“centerist” can be applied to political parties- and to individual candidates.
A candidate running in San Francisco, say, is unlikely to want to be seen as a centerist. A dem running in Nebraska may well wish to be seen that way.
What determines who a PARTY is seen? Is it the sum perception of all the candidates running? Or is it the “platform” that the party lathers over the top of the whole shebang to make it look like a cake?
Welcome, Tom. Great article. Is the “center” really just a collection of folks who haven’t the time or inclination to figure out just which side they are on?
Does anyone think that one way to increase the turnout of unmarried women would be to point out that the higher turnout by women like themselves can have a strong impact on elections?
tom schaller 58 — we’ve long supported WVWV’s efforts. Some (and I think it was Markos, but don’t quote me) actually suggested that with so many single women unregistered that NARAL and PP get into doing this. I really don’t know what kind of limitations would be on them getting involved in this arena, but it seems like it might be effective.
Jane Hamsher @ 61
HEY, MARCY!
i leave it to the experts to figure out unique ways to register these women, but the key, as ever, is reaching people where they live (literally and metaphorically). that means day care centers, that means community colleges, that means senior centers.
“moderates’ and ‘centrists’ are admired by people who don’t vote for them.
emptywheel @ 53
Do you think that the lead for the campaign might have set the tone for that? I have a suspicion that happened. Gender-blindness based in one’s social capital, I thought at the time…
Margot @ 44
Margot, I am going to do my best to hunt down a document that laid out the case for why one vote matters. I know it was the difference in many key elections, just one vote could have changed history. In my state, in my county, six precincts that undervoted by 100 votes each cost us the state senate and put us in a financial crisis (emptywheel can vouch for the seriousness of the crisis). That was 1 in every 12 voters saying the same thing: My vote doesn’t count; why should I vote? Because it does make a huge difference.
I’ll also point to AAUW’s Woman-to-Woman Voter Turnout GOTV effort. AAUW is a strong proponent of equity in education for women, but it’s not just education for which they fight. It’s about equity in opportunity, equity in pay, equity in society. I would love it if we could do more to help AAUW since they have a platform already built and ready to use — and they are women.
Rayne — happy you’re here to talk about registering single women.
Looooong overdue conversation.
Jane Hamsher @ 66
well, NARAL and PP will be part of it, and emily’s list, too. but i’d like to see new and more inventive methods–getting to women as they graduate from community colleges or law school, or through their professional associations, or working-class women in their work and daycare environments.
Fainting couches all around DC.
Does this mean Rahm can show us how tough he is by swearing at us some more?
Let’s hope so.
Welcome, Tom!
tom schaller @ 55
I have wondered, though, whether there is a second split, between those who institutionally support the party (the Kerry/Hillary candidate) and those who are going to be very attracted to the non-party candidate (Dean, McCain in 2000, Nader, Perot). And whether the election of Dean and Van Hollen’s seeming embrace of Dean will be able to attract these people to the party itself. The whole thing would be helped by a Gore candidacy (bc the DLC types are too stupid to figure out that Gore 2000 does not equal Gore 2008). But is there such a correlation in voting patters?
I would tend to agree. Women who affiliate with NARAL/PP are probably already voting… its the ones who don’t get involved that need to be reached out to.
Tom Schaller raises the subject of race in #22. I think reminders of racial rifts are a generally a loser for Democrats, because whites, male and female, get defensive about charges of “racism”, especially when they often make race-informed decisions on where to live and send their kids to school.
There is one area where bringing up race is a winner, however: Republicans cheat in elections by stealing black and Hispanic votes. They are actively, empirically racist in the matter. I would like to see this issue put front and center as a way both to mobilize our black and Hispanic base and to tar the Republicans with a simple label that will violate the great majority of people’s all-American sense of fair play: Republicans Are Cheaters.
I have been advocating registering and voting by telephone for years. Usually I get jeered. But in addition to single woman, there’s a huge pool of working and non working poor and retired, who many times just can’t get to the voting booths who might otherwise vote if it was as easy as picking up the phone. I do think the larger the turnout, the better for left of center candidates and issues.
Pachacutec @ 72
HEY, PACH….let me piggyback on pach’s comment by pulling in something from the news, oh, today…not to mention something the gang at this site is following very closely: the us attorney firings.
the effort by rove and company to get rid of USA’s that didn’t prosecute “fraud” cases is testament to the fact that they can count, too, and they know the demographics are working against them, and in a fair fight or with anything NEAR equal participation, they are doomed to second-party status for a long, long time.
unmarried women voters (who are younger and less white than married voters) are not part of their coalition, and any effort to start moving them toward the polls is viewed with panic and alarm. (and fraud charges!)
Welcome Tom!The Bush administrations policies have taken our country so far to the right (wrong), I knew I was in trouble 4 and a half years ago when I found myself agreeing with Pat Buchanan on quite a few issues (especiallly his stance against the invasion). It looked as if Pat Buchanan represented the middle. Oy Vey!
It seems to me that even if our country swings back to the center tens of thousands of Iraqi people have been killed, injured and millions have been displaced as a direct result of our invasion. The whole world is aware of this crime against humanity.
How can we ever regain any moral integrity (that our country may have had) due to this this tragedy that we are responsible for?
Zbigniew Brezinski, Schlesinger and more think we may never recover from the illegal invasion of Iraq.
Will it really matter if the next elected or selected administration are Democrats or Republicans?
Tom - do you see the two-humped distribution as among informed voters (like those who read this blog) as opposed to the larger mass of low-info citizens?
IIRC, Howard Dean said on TV a while back that 18% of the population think they’re in the top 1% of income earners, and the next 18% think they’re in the top 10%. Is it realistic to take a populist stance when faced with this kind of misinformation?
Gnome de Plume @ 34
The “center” is wherever the particular speaker’s position is located, nothing more nor less.
Tom,
I am a native southerner and would like to expound a littel on the exconic populism. I understand the lack of unions in the south; that’s why many of the manufacturing companies moved there in the first place.
But can’t the economic populism be used to build on the off-shoring of jobs? It is ironic that many of the textiles moved to the south to escape unions and then watched the jobs move to the Caribbean and/or China/VietNam/Korea/etc in the next generation with no recourse. It seems that even wothout unions, the basic fairness (I know nothing in life